Saturday, May 11, 2013

Suit Tuning: The Logi



Does the Logi Suit need some tuning? Many say yes. Before anything else classes must first have the ability to perform the functions they were intended to do. Take the assault for instance: It has solid range, protection, movement and can carry an assortment of equipment. The recon suit has unreal movement and it has shields that make stick and move style tactics possible. The heavy is a slow moving, slow turning tank with high DPS. There are certain traits CCP has hard coded into the game through stats. The recon suit is limited by its low protection and while the Assault is solid in all areas, it is master of none. It is very strong in mid-range engagements but it can't deliver damage like the Heavy in the short area and is neither as protected or as fast as its counterparts.

So what are the Logis strengths? It too is balanced but favors more of a support role. While it can certainly kill targets, its protection doesnt allow it the raw front line protection of the Heavy or Assault but it makes up for this by providing ammo, healing and other indirect methods to assist the mercs under its watch. Would we allow the Heavy to dart around the battlefield like a recon? Can a scout lay down suppressing fire with an HMG? Could an assault player soak up damage like a Heavy? No, CCP has taken the steps to allow customization, but within certain limits that stay true to the function of each class. The question presents itself then, if the Logi can use its PG/CPU to be the ultimate DPS or tank with movement, what exactly are the Heavy and Assault suit for? Recently, Chankk Saotome of SYN offered up a post that shocked many and started some necessary balance discussion.




Caldari Logistics: 5% bonus to Shield Extender Modules
Dropsuit Shield Upgrades: 5% bonus to maximum shield per level (Cal start at 180)
A proto at 5 slots can be running (5*66)*1.25, that's 412 shield from modules alone, max upgrade and another 225, that's 637 shield alone.
Dump in a few armor plates and kinetic booster to balance speed loss and you can have your Logi floating near 1000 HP.

Throw a Duvolle on him and he's now more powerful than any assault with the same on the field and still faster than heavies with near relative HP.

Then he's got his own equipment resupply points.Not sure why you're all complaining about logis with damage mods, CCP just made a bipedal tank who could use a militia smg and kill you in head-on 1v1 should have you significantly more concerned.

'If logis were actually reviving people and providing support along with killing people things would be fine. But Logis aren't reviving people. They are armor/shield/rep stacking and running around with big guns and killing people while their teammates bleed out.'

Did you know the Gallente Logi can get over 1000 Armor?

There's no question this is a design flaw as Logis are not supposed to be the dominant killing or tanking threats on the battlefield. But what can be done?

Various threads that have popped up as a result have some varied responses about how to resolve the issue: 

IMO Logistics should be restricted to a sidearm instead of a light weapon, so they can focus on being Logibros and not Assaults.

I would sacrifice base health, and speed. Then after that my light weapon slot, shortly following by one high, or low slot depending on race. Then, if it really comes to it my grenade slot. THEN I would start giving up more high and low, till I have nothing but my equipment slots.

What about a higher stacking penalty when Logis stack shield and damage mods? Would that work?

I'm a logi player since day 1. I would support a removal of high/low slots and light to sidearm. The reason is because the logi suit isn't specialized, it's basically an open suit to do a little bit of everything in. This is not how I envisioned Dust 514 when they were pitching it to me, where to specialize in something you have to give something else up. To have all these equipment slots we should have to give up our effectiveness in combat. I'm not saying make us ineffective, just less so than an assault. We shouldn't be able to do more damage then them nor have more armor/shields. In contrast, they should never be able to have more than 1 equipment slot.

First don't change the weapon from a light to a side arm that's going to devalue the suit if they cant properly defend them selfs, and then people will simply opted for doing half a logis role as a assault with one equipment. Second knock off some slots a suit designed around using its equipment doesn't need that many slots to do its job. Third buff nanohives and fix injectors, remove any bonuses to tank and change them to something more in line with the logicitics role

Remove the ability for Logi's to fit Damage Mods (Tie it to some fluff about the subroutines being incompatible or some bs)

We happen to agree lesser high and low slots, what are really essential to the  Logis role are equipment slots. It doesnt need a plethora of high/low slots to do its job. Give it one less high and low slot of an assault in the same class and the suit is largely fixed. Asking Logis to use only sidearms or limiting what they can equip hurt the open customization nature of the game. But whatever happens, it has to happen soon because the current poor balance of the suit threatens to upset the equilibrium of the game.

One of the bigger issues is the cross training in regards to the medium suits. Dust is a game that forces players to specialize. We should not be able to obtain a proto level assault suit while creating our logi. This is something that was addressed before with the separation of vehicle and dropsuit skills. Lets not have gameplay return to the period when we could spec into two specialties at once.

As always, we'll continue to attempt to help promote and publish ideas that help establish, enhance and grow the Dust 514 community as much as we can. Have any ideas that need sharing? Would you like to join our staff as a writer? Be sure to contact us at magww@live.com

14 comments:

  1. dude good job but assaults can do the most raw damage by far. you seen the Duvolle damage output?

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  2. I dont understand why you guys insist on using a narrow hinted, bold typeface for body text. It is unreadable.

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  3. *SyN or SyNergy Gaming. Not SYN

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  4. Like I said on the forums if a Logi is the equal of an assault why would anyone play assault? Only an idiot would see the same number of high/low slots with a 3 to 1 difference in equipment slots and choose assault.

    At the same time, shouldnt the Logi be the 2nd fastest suit in the game? (its squishy and needs to get around) it also needs to be less of an ISK sink...after getting dropsuit command level 2 split the tree into Logis and Assaults. There's no reason Logis should have to get level 5 assault before focusing on their skills.

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  5. You want to cure the headache by cutting off the head. Sorry but I am not going to be satisfied protecting my +200K suit with a friggin' sidearm. That is just kitten. I say improvise, adapt and overcome. But if CCP cave to the QQ about Logistics suits then hopefully they have the common sense to just make the suit Invalid unless all of the available equipment slots are used. Do the CPU/PG math and you will find it is a tough time fitting all those complex modules and equipment too.

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    Replies
    1. riiiight. its so tough everyone is doing it. I luv how people who always benefit from the balance always say something cheesy like adapt or htfu up or some other garbage. its a good thing u dont have any logi bias or anything..................

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  6. Sounds like a good idea to me.

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